/2016/11/new_touch_bar_equipped_macbook_pros

Comments

Dicknose:
No one needs the history lesson. Skip to the actual review. The first half of this is wasted space. Skip it.

Once he finally gets to it, it's a fair enough review. Especially from an Apple shill like Gruber.

He calls out some of the good and some of the bad, just like everyone else did about two weeks ago.

> “How’s the Esc key?” is the number one question I’ve gotten from readers about the Touch Bar.

Maybe put the number one question a little higher in your review if so many people think it's important.

Footnote 1. you are a grown man, why do you care about emoji like your wife and daughter?

TLDR don't bother reading Grubers review or my bitching about it. Weeks late and nothing new.
4:12 am — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
ano:
The review embargo on the touchbar macbook pros lifted today, dicknose.

And, speaking of the touchbar: from everything I've seen and read, it appears to be a usability regression compared to the common uses of the old keys (quickly adjusting brightness and volume, etc). It takes longer, you have to adjust your eyes from the screen to the keyboard and back. It's a gimmick.

They sacrificed the feeling of the keyboard for the sake of thinness. Even Gruber grudgingly admits.

They removed ports and extra length cables that were previously included, forcing you to buy extras to actually use the machine.

All this, and they manage to charge hundreds of dollars more than the previous model.

Apple hasn't abandoned the Mac, but they're treating their consumers like bitches.
4:38 am — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
anonymous:
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHHHAAHAHHAHAHHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


AHAHAHAHAHAHHAHHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA

Suckers
1:16 pm — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
ass:
Well this was a waste of time.
2:30 pm — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
anonymous:
The removal of the extension cable seems like the less problematic of the choices

We already have dozens of such cables lying around for years. They can also be replaced by ubiquitous dumb compatible AC cables, much lighter to use.

That shifts the burden on those who enjoy afford the added environmental cost, that's enough for me
2:40 pm — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
anonymous:
If the product were really great, it wouldn't need this much justification. I wonder if Gruber realizes how much the tone and content of his reviews has changed.
3:46 pm — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
Rageous:
The reason the new arrow key arrangement is impossible to use is because you use the negative space in the classic design to align your index and ring fingers on the left and right arrows. This allows your middle finger to fall on the up arrow naturally and you get a sense of location. With the left and right keys now unnecessarily at full size, you have no way of knowing if you're on the arrows or the option key. I have a Magic Keyboard at home and this drives me fucking batshit more than anything else about the new Mac direction. Making those arrows full size was completely unnecessary. They did it to make the keyboard look flush, not because it improved usability. Par for the fucking course, as usual.
4:06 pm — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
knowitall:
Human beings are quite complex mammals. I bet every single problem from the arrow key placement to the shallow keyboard etc.. will just disappear after hours of use and muscle memory takes over.

Its hilarious to hear people talking about having to look at a keyboard to know what something is, when thats exactly how any new set of tools work. Who knew how to use a keyboard straight away? no one.

So there asking you to extend your muscle memory a little more so that you get the benefit of context aware buttons that will improve your ability to control stuff in the long term.

There are guys who have spent their careers memorising cryptic pro tools or final cut pro key commands and want to complain about the magic touch strip.. haha. Surely thats a joke?

6:34 pm — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
Rageous:
Muscle memory is wholly dependent on tactility, and the touch bar has none. It's not that it's impossible (if blind people can do it, that's good enough for everyone else, right?), it's that it creates unnecessary inefficiencies in usability.
6:54 pm — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
anonymous:
@knowitall - Setting aside Rageous's very valid point about the tactile feel making the muscle memory possible, let's assume you are correct that users will adjust.

But every adjustment is a cost. A huge part of the reason behind OSX/macOS/Mac OS X's success is that if you compare today's macOS with OSX 1.0, the basic paradigms are still the same. The Dock is still basically the same thing. The global menu bar is still global and still at the top of the screen. The Apple icon is still at the left of the global menu bar. The Close/Minimize/Right Size controls are still in teh same location on the Windows title bar.

Changing things, even from one way of doing it to a completely equivalent one, holds costs. The problem with Windows has been that small things keep changing with every release (other than when they change massive things, such as in Windows 8), which added up leads to a lot of relearning for every user, which is a user hostile experience.

This isn't an argument for keeping things the same though. It's for recognizing that change has costs associated with it, and therefore the benefits need to justify the cost. I suspect that the TouchBar's benefit to the average user will far outweigh the cost to the more proficient users of losing the ability to change volume without looking down at the keyboard. However, it's obvious the benefits of changing the arrow keys (nicer looking?) don't come close to the costs associated with it.
7:12 pm — Tuesday, 15 November 2016
anonymous:
Why did Apple bother providing Gruber with a review unit? Holy shit what useless drivel!
2:35 am — Wednesday, 16 November 2016
knowitall:
anonymous:

The arrow key stuff I dont know.. The thing with arrow keys is that they are always compromised on laptops compared to a full sized keyboard. And that changes from manufacturer to manufacturer. Going from Apple to Dell might well give you the same issues as Apple slightly changing the layout. So its a moot point in my opinion.

As for the point of it being tactile, the function keys are barely used in day to day operation for most people anyway! They are a relic of PC's from the early 80's

Most people on the mac use it for the volume control and back light stuff. On the PC its used more because Windows in "legacy" and there are lots of old programs that do. I use f10/f11 and f5 on my work pc for visual studio and thats it. 3 keys.

On the mac I dont think apple make software that even uses the function keys, i dont think logic pro does etc..

So it's really not like anyone's really missing anything. And you generally dont touch type with function keys in mind anyway. They are things that you generally have to glance at to use because they arent under your touch key fingers at all.

At the end of the day it's just human nature that rejects paying more when something seems to have been taken away. Especially when you cant imagine the benefit of the replacement because you've never used it before.

I've always thought that "magic keys" or keys that change their labeling based on context would be amazing for professional software like Logic or Pro Tools because of how complex they are.

The ipad is part of this movement because by definition it provides a context aware surface. No one complains that they cant touch type on that!

Likewise this is a tiny incremental change that could provide some of this context aware control that I feel in the long run will benefit professionals.

In five years time if Apple try to remove this watch the whole world scream in horror!

9:50 am — Wednesday, 16 November 2016
webOS & BB10 forever:
I seem to recall the wonderful old PowerBooks from the 90's to be a plastic dark grey in color, not black. For example, my sister's 140 had a nice trackball input device. Am I right the PowerBook never came in black? I hope that Apple brings back a matte black, or even Jet Black, version of all MacBook models. Now those would sell!
1:22 pm — Tuesday, 27 December 2016
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